Alvare, Lewis Disagree on Intent of Vetoed Abortion Bill

Aired April 11, 1996

BERNARD SHAW, Anchor: A presidential veto has pushed the abortion issue back to the election-year center stage. Joining us to discuss the implications - Ann Lewis, deputy campaign manager for the Clinton-Gore reelection campaign, and Helen Alvare, who is with the National Conference of Catholic Bishops.

What is your organization going to do about the president's veto?

HELEN ALVARE, National Conference of Catholic Bishops: First of all, we're going to get the facts straight about what exactly it is he has vetoed, because some are confused. It's a bill that prohibits killing a child who has been mostly delivered outside of his or her mother. It's a procedure that abortionists themselves and even a council of the American Medical Association has said is not medically indicated. In other words, we want to get out the word that he has supported a late-term procedure that is used on live children and that is used without medical without medical indications.

After that, we're going to be trying to support the effort to overturn his veto in Congress. We'll have an easy time of it in the House and a tougher time of it in the Senate, but we're going to push for as many months as it takes, both to educate people as to the nature of the bill and what he's done, and to educate members of Congress to please overturn it.

SHAW: Ann Lewis, has Helen Alvare fairly and accurately stated what the president did?

ANN LEWIS, Clinton Deputy Campaign Manager: No. We believe this issue is one of women's health. And because the president very explicitly said what concerned him was that there was no consideration for women's health in this bill. And so what happened, Bernie, is that the House and Senate voted to tell doctors, to instruct doctors, explicitly to disregard the health of women in coming to determine a medical procedure. That is a dangerous and an unacceptable development, and the president took a stand- let me say the president understands that there will be efforts to use this politically, that we will hear inflammatory rhetoric, that he will be the target of some ugly language, perhaps, and some distortions. He took a stand to protect women and their health, because he thought it was the right thing to do.

SHAW: Is it your view that Catholics in the United States will vote en masse November fifth against Bill Clinton because of this presidential veto?

ALVARE: It's always been the case that abortion has affected votes, and that pro-life voters outnumber their opponents by about two to one. Catholics and others are going to influenced by this. Like I said, they've always been impacted by abortion, but this, in particular, for a couple of reasons. One, the Catholics bishops have been very outspoken, and, number two, because the nature of this veto is so egregious. We're not just talking about abortion in general here; we're talking only about second- and third-trimester abortion and a procedure that kills a live child mostly born. That's going to influence people, even more than past abortion issues influenced them.

LEWIS: You know, the women who were with the president yesterday, who spoke one after another, said, `This is about my life, about my health, about my ability to have children in the future.' One after another told their stories, and they were heart-wrenching stories. They were stories about what happens to a family when, late in a pregnancy, you learn you are going to have to make a very, very difficult choice, and one after another said, `This was hard for us. We did what we felt was right. We are so glad that the president is standing up for us and for our ability to make our decisions about our health, with our doctor, in ways that strengthened our families for years to come.'

I think this is, indeed, an important issue. Helen and I will agree on that. Where we disagree is the impact it's going to have. I think-

ALVARE: We feel-

LEWIS: -for many people watching this - women and men - who heard those women yesterday, who heard those stories, who saw the president step forward and say, `This is about women's health, and this is where I stand- '

ALVARE: I really have to respond to that.

LEWIS: -will respond to the health issue.

ALVARE: The president did surround himself with women who had tragic circumstances. First of all, a couple of them had previously testified under oath that they didn't have the abortion that was banned by the bill. They testified that in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee. Their- I don't know why their testimony was there. Second of all, it is medically uncontested, really, by the leading abortionist, who's written the abortion text book in the country, by the AMA's legislative council, that there is simply not a medical health reason why once a child is 4/5 delivered outside the mother, why there is any medical relevance at all to her health, that she then kill the child as opposed to delivering it the next few inches and allowing it to die naturally.

SHAW: Before we run out time-

ALVARE: This simply is not a health issue.

SHAW: It's not a health issue-

ALVARE: It's not a matter of a health-

SHAW: -you contend. Are Catholics going to vote for Bill Clinton?

LEWIS: I think the president's record on issues that are so important to American Catholics, issues like strengthening the family, building communities, rewarding responsible behavior - those are very important issues, and I think the president, who has been out there, the president, who fought for and signed the family medical leave bill, the president who has been out there, saying we're going to keep the doors of higher education open, the president, who is talking about the issues of social justice - I think that president deserves, and will receive, the votes of large numbers - the majority, I believe.

SHAW: Would it have been politically easier for the president to sign that bill?

ALVARE: You know, it really would have been. And I think both sides agree, on the one hand, he would have- he would have shown pro-life people that there was any substance at all - he has given no substance thus far - to his statement that he wanted abortion to be safe, legal, and rare. Number two, with regard to strong abortion-

SHAW: We've run out of time.

ALVARE: -advocates, where are they going to go?

LEWIS: It would have been politically easier.

SHAW: Ten seconds for you.

LEWIS: I think the president did the right thing. He took a stand for women's health. Doing the right thing tends to work for you eventually politically, and so will this.

SHAW: Thank you very much for joining us.

LEWIS: Thank you.

Copyright © 1996 AllPolitics
All Rights Reserved

Terms under which this information is provided to you