Bennett Prefers Dole Step Down as Majority Leader

Aired April 24, 1996

BERNARD SHAW, Anchor: William Bennett, the Empower America co-chairman and former education secretary, joins us here on Inside Politics.

When you look at Senator Dole and the campaign, do you see molasses or mercury?

WILLIAM BENNETT, Empower America: [laughs] I'd like to see more mercury. What I see is not nearly as much forward movement and progress as I'd like to see. I mean, it's time to break out of funk and boredom and molasses, and get cracking. Get going.

SHAW: RNC Chairman Haley Barbour says that you should understand that running around talking publicly the way you've been is a no no, and that you should be part of the solution.

BENNETT: Well, Haley Barbour should know that this is what Bill Bennett does. I commit lots of public acts. I usually say what I think, and I think I meant it constructively. I am a critic, but I am what Madison called and I would aspire to be a `loving critic' in this regard.

I like Bob Dole. I have a lot of regard for Bob Dole. We've worked together on a lot of things. I like the people in the campaign, but, look, Bernie, when we start, three, four weeks ago, we're down 14, 15 points, and now you just report we're down by 20 points, I would- I would suggest that this is not the direction we want to be heading. We want to be heading the other way, and there are opportunities, it seems to me, for Bob Dole to advance on Bill Clinton.

SHAW: How does Bob Dole erase the president's double-digit lead?

BENNETT: Well, it seems to me, first of all, by presenting himself not as a guy who primarily will deal with Bill Clinton as the majority leader. That invites people to see him as someone who makes deals and someone who sits in the Senate, but rather who challenges him not on dealing, but on leading the country.

And I would suggest the following, just very quickly. Crime and drugs - I mean, we may see the greatest increase in drug use in this country ever under Bill Clinton's administration. Crime is a terrible problem in America. He has not ended welfare as he said he would. We still count by race in this society, and that needs to be addressed. The role of the judiciary is overreaching on birth, on death, on marriage, on all sorts of things. There are lots of lines that Bob Dole can draw. Private meetings at the White House, making deals with Clinton, is not the way to present himself - in my view. The best way is as a challenger for president.

SHAW: Should Dole come out of the Senate cloak room and abandon his job as majority leader and campaign full time?

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BENNETT: Well, I think he should, but it matters less, I think, whether he does it de facto or de jure. He can remain as majority leader and say to Trent Lott, I'm, you know, delegating you to carry the load. But operating from Washington, even from the well of the Senate, is not the most popular place in America. It is not the place where people see you as the leader of the country. He wants to be seen as the leader of the country, not the leader of the Senate.

So, I would suggest that instead of getting caught up in these issues. I mean, look at this terrible- you talk about molasses, look at the trap this minimum wage thing has been. Instead of getting caught in the middle of something like that, it seems to me he should be out articulating our principles, where we stand, and asking and demanding some truth in presentation from Bill Clinton. Not attacks on the president - not attacks on the person. But on the public character.

SHAW: For Senator Dole, will you be a surrogate on the issue, say, of the president's judicial appointments?

BENNETT: I would, though I think he wants do more than talk about judicial appointments. I think he wants to talk about the judiciary. I think Bob Dole should talk about late-term abortions-

SHAW: You're saying you would?

BENNETT: I would be happy to be a surrogate for Bob Dole.

SHAW: Thank you. Pardon me for the interruption.

BENNETT: But I think he should take him on on late-term abortions, where a lot of Democrats were with the Republican party, where his own ambassador, Ray Flynn [sp], ambassador to the Vatican, said that he had to oppose the president on this. This was a wicked and cynical act, and this is- this is, unfortunately, fairly typical Bill Clinton.

SHAW: Is Dole an 18-carat conservative?

BENNETT: Well, I think Bob Dole's a true conservative, but Bob Dole is not the kind of conservative- what a lot of the conservatives I hang around with who, you know, read a lot of books and develop their theories from reading Phonmeises [sp] and all these 19th century figures.

Bob Dole is an instinctive conservative. He's a Kansas conservative. If you ask Bob Dole, you know, what do you think about doctors helping people die, or what do you think about gay marriage, he's going to say, what are you talking about? You know, this doesn't make any sense to me. And that's fine. That kind of thing can be worth more than Bill Clinton.

SHAW: So, essentially, in sum, you're trying to light a fire under Bob Dole's butt?

BENNETT: [laughs] I'd like to see Bob Dole-

SHAW: Well, is that not true?

BENNETT: I'd like to see the energized and principled Bob Dole out there saying to the American people, this is the things for which this party stands. We are not in favor of the minimum wage; it's not going to do any good. This is a cynical election-year ploy. Let's call it what it is.

SHAW: Do you think he's going to lose or win?

BENNETT: I sure hope he's going to win, and we haven't started yet. We're only 20 points down. We haven't started yet. That's the good news. That's the good spin on it. If he gets going, he can win.

SHAW: Thank you - Bill Bennett.

BENNETT: Thank you.

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