India's A.P.J. Abdul Kalam. ROBERT NICKELSBERG FOR TIME

They share a name and an unofficial title: Father of His Country's Nuclear Bomb. The similarities don't end there. Both men are Muslims, and both regard themselves as men of peace. They certainly have pacific hobbies: India's A.P.J. Abdul Kalam, 67, writes poetry and plays the veena, a stringed instrument not unlike the sitar; Pakistan's Abdul Qadeer Khan, 59, feeds wild monkeys. Khan says they have one other thing in common: "He is a patriot, and I am a patriot." In separate interviews, the two men shared their views on their life's work--and its possible consequences--with TIME correspondents. Excerpts:

TIME: Why does India need nuclear weapons?
Kalam: Two of our neighbors have nuclear weapons. We didn't have an alternative. For national security reasons, we had to explode nuclear devices.

TIME: Should India sign the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty now?
Kalam: The tests we conducted in May generated sufficient data for nuclear weaponization. So we need no further tests. As for the CTBT, it is for the nation to take a holistic view on this. Actually, we had planned six tests in May. We stopped the last one as we felt we had got the data we wanted.

TIME: Some Western experts say India exaggerated the strength of its tests.
Kalam: Measuring nuclear yield depends on multiple parameters--the location and number of instruments, the geology of the area, the location of the seismic station in relation to the test site. The New Scientist took data from 125 seismic stations, and their analysis closely matches ours. We measured it at 5.4 on the Richter scale, which is equivalent to a yield of 58 kilotons, plus or minus 5 kilotons.

TIME: Will the U.S. sanctions and the blacklisting of a number of Indian scientific organizations affect your work?
Kalam: Actually, the sanctions have ignited young minds. Every day a new software or hardware product is coming out of my laboratories. No sanction can stand against ignited minds.

TIME: Can India pursue its missile development program while sanctions remain in place?
Kalam: We are self-reliant in our missile program--90% of our items are made in India. We do not depend on any country for any critical technology.

TIME: Why is it that India and Pakistan have so much in common, yet are at each other's throats?
Kalam: Europe fought for 100 years. It's a process. One day on the subcontinent a transformation will take place.

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